anghraine | Entries tagged with ch: william collins

I have a longer post in drafts about it, but … one of the things I really enjoy about Austen is that she doesn’t hold back judgment of her characters or even altogether deny them agency (though her fandom sometimes does!), but she also frequently goes out of her way to highlight the experiences that have influenced their development into who they are.

Especially (though not exclusively) when it comes to her main characters, her good people aren’t good because they just had the innate moral fortitude to shrug off their upbringings or the things that have happened to them, which seems to be a lot of people’s idea of goodness. Austen main characters are good people and they’re impacted by their experiences and have qualities (often flaws) that clearly arise more out of upbringing than any essential underlying characteristic. Goodness isn’t just about super-resilience, but neither is experience wholly defining.

It’s not at all restricted to Austen, of course, but even now (…particularly now), it’s so refreshing.

Tagged: #i'm so tired of the resilience narrative or blank slate narrative #and i was thinking of how elizabeth/darcy is one of comparatively few ships i'm really into where the characters #are just about squeaky clean—and i think part of it (aside of their general magnificence lol) is it's not a magic resilience thing at all #she is extremely clear about the ways in which they have been influenced—mostly for the worse—by their experiences #they're allowed to be good AND to be affected by their lives in natural ways #shouldn't be as refreshing as it is but it's one of the things i keep going back for

[ETA 4/30/2024: I was also thinking about Mr Collins, of all people—Austen doesn't justify him in any way, obviously, but also doesn't try to pretend that his upbringing and history aren't what made him who he is. The effects of education, upbringing, and general history on people's characters and morals are a constant preoccupation of her books, IMO.]

Current Location: Washington
Current Music: Still Within the Sound of My Voice (Linda Ronstadt)

An anon asked:

You’re an INTJ and you accept the common typing of Darcy as an INTJ, right? Well, I’ve just found a few people arguing that Darcy is actually a Sensor, arguing that a real Ni-dom would have better predicted that Wickham would target Lydia or some other young girl, and citing the fact that he misjudges Jane’s feelings for Bingley based on appearances. Would you argue that he’s still an INTJ despite the above, and if so, how?

I replied:

Yes, I’m an INTJ, and yes, I accept (and relish!) the usual INTJ-typing for him.

I’ll say upfront that I like the MBTI, but also have issues with it as a system and haven’t dug into the details for a long time. My friend

tree could probably answer this question better than I can.

But personally, I think one of the issues with discussion of it is that people tend to flatten everything about someone into the type and ignore other, individualizing motivations they have. IMO that’s part of what’s happening here.

So, to begin with, it’s less that Darcy did or didn’t intuit that Wickham was dangerous than that, due to upbringing (rather than temperament), Darcy initially didn’t register anything as important unless it touched on his own “family” circle—a circle that is inclusive of his friends and dependents, but not of strangers or simple acquaintances. Once Wickham wasn’t on his radar, eh.

With regard to Jane, we’re told that Darcy wanted Bingley to marry Georgiana, and that this factored into Darcy's involvement in the whole situation, even though he tried to keep it from affecting his judgment of Jane. I think the pretty clear implication is that he failed.

But the thing I find interesting about Darcy is that, despite his pride, and despite his biases, his judgments about people’s underlying characters are right a lot more often than you’d expect. He’s not wrong about Mrs Bennet and the younger girls. He rightly has reservations about Mr Bennet. He, also rightly, considers Mr Collins lucky to have married Charlotte, even though he barely knows either of them. He’s right that Elizabeth and Jane are concerned with propriety and excludes Jane as well as Elizabeth from his condemnation of the family in general.

And I don’t think these judgments are really following from considered observations that have eventually led him to a conclusion (sometimes he thinks so, but IMO he’s already reached his conclusions). They’re fast, influenced by both his general beliefs and by quick, subconscious observations coming together. What gives him the appearance of a more deliberate, straightforward thought process, I think, is his need to account for the new information he keeps accumulating after reaching a judgment. He will adjust his early conclusions to make all the data work, even though changing his mind troubles him.

Basically, he’s someone who has good intuitive judgment of character, but gets so caught up in his own ideas and thoughts that he sometimes misses what’s right in front of his face, though his need to keep integrating all information he receives usually keeps him from going too far astray. As I said, I’m no MBTI expert, but that just doesn’t sound like an ISTJ at all to me. I think Ni+Te makes a lot more sense.

(That said, I do think that a lot of readings of Darcy sound pretty ISTJ-ish, very much including academic ones. I just don’t think the character himself is.)

Tagged: #i saw a gifset the other day with him as istj and i was just like ... lol no #maybe in the movie i guess but canon darcy? no

Current Location: Washington
Current Music: How Can I Go On (Freddie Mercury & Montserrat Caballé)

Snowflake Challenge promotional banner with image of metallic snowflake and ornaments. Text: Snowflake Challenge January 1-31.

Hey everyone! It's nearly 11 PM on January 31st and I'm sick, but I threw words on the page until I had something to show for it for challenge #11 specifically:

In your own space, create a fanwork. Now, a fanwork is anything that you, a fan, creates. Fic, icons, and filling sparkly requests from your fellow snowflakes’ wishlists absolutely fit the bill. But really, your creation can be anything! Draw something, paint something, compose an ode to your current favorite movie. Whittle something to represent your fandom from a bit of driftwood or model it in clay and matchsticks or legos! Whip up a song about your favorite trope or concoct an interpretive dance number for your OTP. Bake some cupcakes and decorate them in homage to your favorite TV show or author. The possibilities are endless. Whatever means of self-expression tickles your fancy right now, embrace it! But most of all - have fun!

I thought of doing something simpler or easier but ... no, instead I word vomited the entire prologue to the Commander Elizabeth Bennet P&P/Mass Effect AU into a GoogleDoc. It's largely unedited but here it is!

Prologue

Elizabeth Bennet knew what people called her behind her back, whether they were Alliance or not.

The butcher of Torfan.

They didn’t understand. Nobody did, really, not even Captain Gardiner, who’d defended her to the tribunal, or Major Massey, who’d ordered her to take Torfan at any cost and been honorably discharged later.

Elizabeth was resigned to that. When she could do something about a problem, she acted; when she couldn’t, she let it go. And she couldn’t do anything about the past.

Least of all when she didn’t regret it.

Mira Gardiner was a failure.

A failure with a case full of medals, to be sure. She’d served the Alliance—served humanity—for decades, and the Alliance had rewarded her with a stream of commendations and promotions. Nobody talked about her lost chance to do more for their species. Not in her hearing, anyway. Even she hadn’t really thought about it in years. No point in wasting time recollecting the details when there was work to be done.

The more amorphous sense of failure, though: that lingered. Especially on the Normandy.

( Read more... )

Current Location: Washington
Current Music: Here I Go Again (Whitesnake)

I talked in my last Snowflake post about my Commander Elizabeth Bennet AU: a P&P/Mass Effect fusion with Elizabeth as Shepard that’s simmering in my brain right now. I may or may not actually write it, but I do want to get the story nailed down for myself, and I’ve gotten the basic set-up established—at least, I think so!

I didn’t want to explain the entire fic (...should I write it someday) on Tumblr, but I still wanted to share some part of it with the fandom friends who might care (I’m actually very excited!). So I thought I’d post about the set-up for the story over here on Dreamwidth.

The story opens on Mira Gardiner, a decorated officer of the human Systems Alliance and captain of a new, state-of-the-art, stealth Alliance starship, the SSV Normandy (I thought about Waterloo, but idk). Captain Gardiner’s staid XO, William Collins, is her current right hand and presumed successor as captain of the Normandy according to Alliance protocols. But there’s a complication.

For years, humanity has been trying to get accepted into the powerful galactic Council, and one major step in that direction would be the appointment of a human to the elite Spectres that act on the Council’s behalf. Captain Gardiner herself was once under consideration to join the Spectres, and served a mission under the observation of the turian Specter Saren Arterius, but failed in mysterious circumstances. Now, years later, the Council is finally re-considering the appointment of a human to the Spectres, and has reached out to Captain Gardiner again. They’re not re-considering her; the current (oblivious) candidate is her favorite protégée, Commander Elizabeth Bennet. They want Elizabeth transferred to the Normandy for a secret mission under the supervision of the Spectre Nihlus.

Elizabeth is a controversial figure these days. She’s always been respectful, clever, and pleasant, even charming, but she’s never backed down from anyone or anything. She recently triumphed in a brutal battle on Torfan with batarian slavers; her forces were obliterated by the batarians, but Elizabeth used her tactical and technological expertise to not only survive but to wipe out the batarians. Captain Gardiner herself defended Elizabeth’s actions to the Alliance high command—and apparently Elizabeth’s resourcefulness and resolve at Torfan caught the eye of more than the Alliance.

( Read more... )

Current Location: Washington
Current Music: Mass Effect Theme (Jack Wall, Sam Hulick)

I made progress on the next chapter of LP&D, which is the chapter, at last:

It was during that third week that Mr Collins returned from his usual morning call to Rosings in a state of considerable excitement. Colonel Fitzwilliam and Miss Darcy had arrived at Rosings not long before, perhaps an hour, and he had seen them both. The ladies, even Elizabeth, listened carefully to all he could say of them. It was Mr Collins, so he took a great many words to say a very little, but he did manage to express that Miss Darcy was a handsome and elegant lady, equal to her cousin Miss de Bourgh, and Colonel Fitzwilliam was most amiable, as must be expected of a nephew of so affable and kind a patroness as Lady Catherine.

Elizabeth, though not inclined to trust Mr Collins’s opinions in most matters, supposed from this that Miss Darcy was not amiable, and Colonel Fitzwilliam was not handsome.

f i n a l l y

Current Location: Washington
Current Music: Fire and Ice (Pat Benatar)

awesomenell65 reblogged this post, and added a comment about how regrettable it is that the Gardiners are so sidelined in adaptation.

I replied:

I think it throws off the balance of who is really important, and what behaviors are being held up as admirable in Austen’s work, in this novel in particular.

This, exactly. It’s especially important because of Austen’s enduring preoccupation with the effects of education and upbringing on how people develop and who they become. P&P in particular highlights the failures of parents and parental figures over and over (even Mr Collins has a bad parenting backstory!). The Gardiners are virtually the only exception to this (both w/ their own children and with their influence on Jane and Elizabeth), and their intermittent but persistent presence right up to the last line centers the qualities that are really important in going forward, and undercuts the importance of others, especially class.

Tagged:

#the gardiners are both some of the lowest-ranking characters in the book #and the most purely benevolent #in a way that's not really saccharine at all #but it's... not sure how to put this #but #adaptations are always choosing to foreground certain elements and minimize others in their retellings #this is an inevitable part of adapting things—and /what/ is chosen for each can be very suggestive #beyond just weighing judgment on whether it's faithful / unfaithful #it would be perfectly possible for adaptations to foreground class /more/ than the book does #and instead it's largely diminished and when addressed it's in a super reductionist way #and that reflects a general lack of interest in it that i think particularly influences the treatment of the gardiners and mrs reynolds

Current Location: Washington
Current Music: Don't Know Much (Linda Ronstadt ft. Aaron Neville)

An anon asked, in response to some collective wishful thinking:

Who would you cast in the new pride and prejudice adaptation???

I replied:

Oh, I’m terrible with fancasting, sorry! It makes me feel old, lol, but I don’t really know most actors except the really big names (who I wouldn’t want for P&P).

I do think it’s important that, apart from parental figures, the cast basically runs from 15 to 30. P&P is fundamentally about young people, and I think that should be reflected in the casting. Elizabeth, Bingley, and Jane are in their early twenties. Mr Collins, Charlotte, Darcy, and Wickham are closer to 25 than 35. The teenage girls should be teenage girls.

I would really prefer casting where Jane, Darcy, and Wickham are very conventionally attractive while Elizabeth is more ordinary-looking. I’d also like to escape the tendency to use blondness/thinness as coding for personality.

Otherwise … I imagine there are a lot of options, really.

Current Mood: calm
Current Location: Washington
Current Music: A Path With Heart (David Lanz)

It's not really meta, but I want to preserve it anyway.

So, awhile back I might have counted the number of times the characters in P&P smile, or are mentioned as smiling. For general edification:

( Read more... )

A Tumblr anon asked:

I don't know if you answered this before but do you think Mr. Collins proposal or Mr. Darcy's first proposal was more insulting?

My response (predictably):

Mr Collins. Darcy manages to stop short of 1) itemizing her dowry, 2) saying nobody else would ever want to marry her, and 3) insisting that no means yes because women are sadistic liars.

( Read more... )

Current Mood: blah
Current Location: Portland, OR
Current Music: Edge of Seventeen (Stevie Nicks)

Vindication of the Rights of Woman, Ch 3

I will go further, and affirm, as an indisputable fact, that most of the women, in the circle of my observation, who have acted like rational creatures, or shewn any vigour of intellect, have accidentally been allowed to run wild—as some of the elegant formers of the fair sex would insinuate.

hm

Pride and Prejudice, Ch 9:

“Lizzy,” cried her mother, “remember where you are, and do not run on in the wild manner that you are suffered to do at home.”

Pride and Prejudice, Ch 19

“Do not consider me now as an elegant female intending to plague you, but as a rational creature speaking the truth from her heart.”

hmmm

Current Mood: bouncy
Current Location: Oakland(ish)
Current Music: Summer of '69 (Bryan Adams)

I'm a little behind, but I spent seven hours at the mall yesterday, so I don't feel I'm slacking that much! These ones are both totally obvious, anyway.

( Read more... )

Current Location: Portland, OR
Current Music: Like You
Crossposts: http://elizabeth-hoot.livejournal.com/142712.html

I noticed that I hadn't got around to posting anything I'd done in... eh, awhile, so here are the fics I've written recently(ish) and not posted:

( Read more... )

Current Location: St Helens, OR
Current Music: Another One Bites the Dust
Crossposts: http://elizabeth-hoot.livejournal.com/113152.html

I've discovered that I don't hate religion, per se, just mine. Um, yay.

But seriously. A teacher explaining that there has only ever been one universally accepted model of marriage until now as the lesson to be learned from Abraham's family is so horrifically wrong that, in retrospect, it starts coming around the other side. ~~That family tree is the simplified version I made to help me sort out the main characters. Now I wish I'd drawn it on the board.~~

---------------

Title: First Impressions (8/13, 9/13)

Fanverse: First Impressions

Blurb: Henry finishes his trip to Hunsford, discusses the fallout with Jane, then goes with the Gardiners to Pemberley and gets another harsh dose of reality.

---------------

( Chapter Eight )

( Chapter Nine )

Current Location: St Helens, OR
Current Music: Had I Been In Love

I keep running across a not-quite-trope -- an argument -- that I find immensely problematic. I'm going to talk about it now, through my own feminism, which may not be yours. Consider yourself warned for that, along with discussions of violence and sexual assault.

( A defense of double standards )

---------------

Title: First Impressions (6/13, 7/13)

Fanverse: First Impressions

Blurb: Jane goes to the Gardiners' and Henry to the Collinses'; Henry meets Lady Catherine, Anne, Colonel Fitzwilliam, and (once again) Catherine; many hints are dropped.

---------------

( Chapter Six )

( Chapter Seven )

Current Location: St Helens, OR
Current Music: Different Drum
Crossposts: http://elizabeth-hoot.livejournal.com/107639.html

---------------

Title: First Impressions (4/13, 5/13)

Fanverse: First Impressions

Blurb: Mr Collins chooses the companion of his future life, Mr Wickham tells of his tragic, tragic life, the Netherfield Ball happens, as does some minor inbreeding.

---------------

( Chapter Four )

( Chapter Five )

Current Location: St Helens, OR
Current Music: Leaving Netherfield

I cannot say how many times I have heard certain fanon "facts" about appearance repeated over and over - and they're not just popular and prevalent, like a good deal of fanon, either. With appearance, people will actually insist that they're what Austen/the book says. e.g., Jane is listed under the TV Tropes entry "Hair of Gold," with this explanation:

Following the frequent book descriptions as 'fair-haired', in the two most recent film adaptations of Pride And Prejudice, the prettiest (and most innocent) daughter, Jane, is a blonde

It's stretched far beyond purely Internet fanon, too: Colin Firth's hair, eyebrows, and eyelashes were actually dyed for the 1995 P&P; blonde Jennifer Ehle wore a dark wig for Elizabeth and even Susannah Harker's naturally blonde hair was lightened. Mary got spots, and Mr Collins grease. The 2005 P&P likewise gave Keira Knightley a wig much darker than her naturally light brown/dark blonde hair, and Matthew Macfadyen insisted that he wasn't dark enough to physically resemble Austen's Darcy.

So, given the rampant assumptions and clichés, I decided to track down what canon actually tells (or more often, doesn't tell) us about what the characters look like.

( Read more... )

Current Location: St Helens, OR
Current Music: I'll Be Watching You

[Reposted from wordpress]

(2) What should we read into the fact that Lydia is both the youngest and tallest of the Bennet girls?

A1: Let’s see. She’s overgrown and immature? The sisters who seem closest to her in nature are both slight and delicate - fundamentally different? Yet another parallel to tall, womanly Georgiana Darcy? I can keep going if you want.

( Read more... )

Current Location: St Helens, OR
Current Music: It's Raining Men

[repost from wordpress]

I read the oddest essay. It’s rather old, dating (I think) from the 1880s. The basic point of the essay was that, in terms of characterisation, the best character in Pride and Prejudice is Mr Collins. The author went on to detail his many delightful quirks and foibles. I have seen it argued that the relationship at the heart of the novel is that between Elizabeth and Jane, Elizabeth and Mr Bennet, Elizabeth and Elizabeth, and even (by a few brave souls) Elizabeth and Darcy. This person insisted that the author’s focus was on Mr Collins.

( Read more... )

Current Location: Corvallis, OR
Current Music: Scales and Arpeggios

Profile

Anghraine

April 2025

S	M	T	W	T	F	S
		1	2	3	4	5
6	7	8	9	10	11	12
13	14	15	16	17	18	19
20	21	22	23	24	25	26
27	28	29	30

Syndicate

Page Summary

Tumblr crosspost (4 February 2021)
Tumblr crosspost (19 September 2020)
Snowflake Challenge #11
The Commander Elizabeth Bennet AU!
*\0/*
Tumblr crosspost (13 April 2020)
Tumblr crosspost (30 June 2019)
crosspost: smiles! [Dec 2013]
Tumblr ask: Darcy vs Collins
Okay, this was happy making
Days 5 & 6
fic catch-up
First Impressions (8 + 9)
If things were different, they wouldn't be the same + FI 6 & 7
First Impressions (4 & 5)
Ten Facts About Appearance in P&P
So You Think You Know Jane Austen? (Misc - A)
Mr Collins vs Elizabeth and Darcy

Active Entries

Style Credit

Style: Dark Blue for Funky Circles by ninetydegrees

Expand Cut Tags

No cut tags

Page generated Apr. 23rd, 2025 05:36 pm